SON OF ZUBE! (Hey Zube 2022)

[Lord Reith]

Rockband was the first project released by Apple using AI Demixing Technology("multitracks-Stems"). No other attempt of releasing a new mix by using AI Technology since then,(Get Back Project used Peter Jackson´s Technology(sarcasm!)) but do you see a new Release by Apple in the near future, could it be Please please me Deluxe 2023 ???

Rockband used CEDAR if I remember rightly, which was (is) an insanely expensive bit of kit which was the first time audio could be converted into editable spectrograms. So there was no actual AI involved there, just a lot of painstaking manual work. These days an algorithm analyses the spectrogram instead of a human, using the same visual deep learning technology originally developed for driverless cars and such.

I really hope they do not attempt PPM in 2023. They are not anywhere near ready.

[Ziggy C]

I love the demixes/remixes that have circulated. Some of them (ahem....LR, and a few others) are exceptional. Done with an ear to how it might have been done if stereo sound had been fully embraced, appreciated, and applied back then. What I like about work such as Hey Zube/Son Of Zube is that it doesn't stray too far into trickery. The mix is done with an eye looking towards what might have been done in 1963. No extra pizzazz. No "in-yo-face" guitar solos. Just the album, presented expertly, as a take-it-or-leave-it. I love it.

I also tend to appreciate and love the original mono mixes because that's what came out back then. That was "it."

I seriously doubt that anyone working for the record industry gives more than a rat's ass about making a better product. Not even Apple. These days, especially not Apple. I really hope that they lay low for about ten years or so. Allow some real cool cats who have evolved with this new technology to apply their craft to this work. Presently there is no need, other than a cash grab, to launch inferior reissues at the wall.

[ruedabeat]

Rockband was the first project released by Apple using AI Demixing Technology("multitracks-Stems"). No other attempt of releasing a new mix by using AI Technology since then,(Get Back Project used Peter Jackson´s Technology(sarcasm!)) but do you see a new Release by Apple in the near future, could it be Please please me Deluxe 2023 ???

Rockband used CEDAR if I remember rightly, which was (is) an insanely expensive bit of kit which was the first time audio could be converted into editable spectrograms. So there was no actual AI involved there, just a lot of painstaking manual work. These days an algorithm analyses the spectrogram instead of a human, using the same visual deep learning technology originally developed for driverless cars and such.

I really hope they do not attempt PPM in 2023. They are not anywhere near ready.

Wow!! Thanks for the comment My Master Lord.

[ruedabeat]

I love the demixes/remixes that have circulated. Some of them (ahem....LR, and a few others) are exceptional. Done with an ear to how it might have been done if stereo sound had been fully embraced, appreciated, and applied back then. What I like about work such as Hey Zube/Son Of Zube is that it doesn't stray too far into trickery. The mix is done with an eye looking towards what might have been done in 1963. No extra pizzazz. No "in-yo-face" guitar solos. Just the album, presented expertly, as a take-it-or-leave-it. I love it.

I also tend to appreciate and love the original mono mixes because that's what came out back then. That was "it."

I seriously doubt that anyone working for the record industry gives more than a rat's ass about making a better product. Not even Apple. These days, especially not Apple. I really hope that they lay low for about ten years or so. Allow some real cool cats who have evolved with this new technology to apply their craft to this work. Presently there is no need, other than a cash grab, to launch inferior reissues at the wall.

I also love all the Mixes /Remixes done by the community, I still remember those days playing with a Mono Recorder in order to hear only one track from the Stereo Cassetes. Those were the early 80's(1982) when I discover I could make OOPS with a tricky conecctions in the turntable, so I´ve enjoyed making all those mixes(analogue) and then digital editions, going thru the Beatles Remixers Group and getting in touch with masters of the digital edition. If I can mention a few: Maggocus, Veech, Mirror Spock and the Master Lord-R just to mention a few.

I thank I can get the new technologies and do all that magic that I can get with the new AI technologies. I can do my own "in-yo-face" guitar solos or any combination for my own pleasure (viewtopic.php?f=27&t=4311 ) But most of all, get all those mixes done by the Masters.

Thanks a lot !!!

PS. Beatles 4ever !!!!

[Lord Reith]

There are a lot of people doing remixes now for sure. This is a good thing because it encourages everybody to strive for a higher level. Friendly rivalry is always the best environment to thrive in.

[stereoman33]

There are a lot of people doing remixes now for sure. This is a good thing because it encourages everybody to strive for a higher level. Friendly rivalry is always the best environment to thrive in.

Yes i just heard the remixes by Prof Stoned Who has remixed the first three Beatles lps.available for download on his website
Interesting i dont think he fixed the vocal fluff in the Please please me lp version, but he fixed the harmonica mess at the end of the song with no artifacts.
Does very good job on the mono please please me single and the love me do, ps i love you, how do you do it, she loves you and ill get you
The more the merrier!

[Lord Reith]

Yes i just heard the remixes by Prof Stoned Who has remixed the first three Beatles lps.available for download on his website

Thanks for the heads up. These sound very good and he's done a similar panning to what I did. Artefacts are at a minimum.

he fixed the harmonica mess at the end of the song with no artifacts.

Yeah but the echo on the vocal is still there. Removing that was what caused the artefacts in my mix (if that's what you meant).

Clayton Hickman is doing the covers?! He was the guy who did the Dr Who dvd covers. Never knew he was a fan.

[millerTEK]

Lord Reith!

I noticed you list Chains as Take 4 - is that correct? The 'book' notes 4 takes were done that day, and Take 1 was chosen as the best, given a faded ending on the 25th and used for the final mix of PPM. I found other sources that 'used' this track (see Pumma4's post of the PPM spectral stereo project), but they marked it as Take 1...and in comparing, these are clearly the same tracks (with the faded ending). I would have assumed since Take 4 was not used - it was have a faded ending. Can you check and tell me which is which??

I must admit, I was hesitant to listen to these remixed concepts of the PPM sessions at first as I stuck by the concept that I should have the sessions as they were recorded....but after listening to your mix centering the vocals and drums...it dawned on me how more pleasant the listening experience had become and that explained why I never really liked listening to these in their original recorded form, because there is a harshness and awkwardness I discovered that depending on where one sits in the room, either the vocals overwhelm or the instruments in the other speaker overwhelm if one sits on the opposite end of the room! I GET IT!

I then compared your latest mix to that Spectral Mix source that was also available and discovered your mix so much smoother and puts the drums more centered than this spectral mix does...that allows the instrumentation (guitars) to be heard better without their volume being raised and becoming harsh. Sort of solving the problems of the recorded mixes are always fighting among themselves to dominate.

Of course we know once those final mixes were created on the 25th, I see why George Martin likes the mono mixes better. He always intended to move the vocals to the center, but during the recording sessions, needed them separated as much as possible to make that possible and I guess because he knew a stereo mix would be requested...

Well I hope what I have wrote makes sense - and I wanted to thank you for your hard work! I'm a fan now! I have been wanting to improve my early session collection for a long time. You made that happen!

steve

[millerTEK]

Found something with Misery session sources starting with Take 7 - note Take 7 is the last take that we get to hear George picking his electric during the 2 middle-eights which eventually got scrapped. Since we never hear discussion in between these takes, we don;t know when the decision was made to tell George to no longer pick his electric during those sections. Take 8 broke down and never got to the 1st middle-eight to see what would have been played.

But now with Take 9 - a piano is FIRST HEARD PLAYING during those 2 sections replacing George's guitar. So....is George Martin trying out a proposal that piano would sound better there then electric guitar? You see, that playing is pretty similar to the piano overdubs recorded later on Feb 20th during Takes 12-16 (Take 16 was the take used for the final album mixing).

That leaves us with a missing Take 10, and then seeing the logic in reconstructing Take 11 - as knowing piano overdubs on Feb 20th started at Take 12 - it would appear that they had to play a complete run-through of the song with NOTHING in those 2 sections and that was what the reconstructed Take 11 would have sounded like for that purpose.

Maybe Take 10 was a false start or something...who knows...but in any case - what peaked my curiosity was hearing well established piano parts in Take 9 that would have seemed to me to have been too early to be hearing a piano. I would think Martin would have REHEARSED his piano proposal and actually recorded a Take including it, knowing it would be overdubbed later and now he just needed them to record a full run-through leaving those sections empty for the base track and Take 11 was it.

any ideas?

[millerTEK]

I may have found the answer to my question about Takes 9, missing Take 10 and 11....

http://www.beatlesebooks.com/misery

This source claims the Feb 11 sessions ended Misery at Take 9 which was a FULL RUN THROUGH WITHOUT ANY PIANO or GUITAR in those parts.

THEN on Feb 20th, the Beatles were not present - I'll copy and paste the text for the rest -

George Martin experimented with adding piano overdubs onto "take nine" (this is the common INCOMPLETE take 9 most sources use) but, upon listening to The Beatles performance, decided that the first half of the song was flawed in various ways, such as a speeded up tempo at the end of the first verse and a flubbed bass note from Paul at the beginning of the song.

George Martin decided to perform an edit of two different "takes" to get the finished master of The Beatles' performance; the first half of "take seven" and the second half of "take nine." Upon listening to the original recordings of both "takes," it appears that the main edit occurs just as the third verse begins (at the word "shend") while George's guitar run in the first bridge of "take seven" must have been edited out as well. With this complete, George Martin went back to work in performing his piano overdubs onto what was now "take 11," playing the exact riff that Harrison was playing on the guitar, only in octaves and, of course, with perfect timing. He also played a piano arpeggio on top of George’s introductory guitar chord and added two accent notes in between the lyrics in the final two measures of each bridge. It took five takes for him to complete these overdubs to his satisfaction (takes 12 through 16).

So kool!

PS -
SO this RECONSTRUCTED TAKE 11 - I notice the bass notes in the intro are not out of tune! you must have known this. So technically you can have 2 Take 9's - the incomplete one you with the out of bass intro, and George Martin testing the piano and you could reconstruct a FULL Take9 without any of the piano and make a similar second half that's empty of piano and guitar to complete it.

have fun!

steve