Disque Americ Revolver

Fan created remixes and rare variations
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robertswipe
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Re: Disque Americ Revolver

Post by robertswipe »

First time poster here....
Just want to open by thanking His Lordship for the incredible work he continues to do and for bringing so much joy to so many of us. I've been listening to the Beatles since childbirth and I'm constantly amazed at how many new details and insights there are still to be had thanks to your restorations and recommendations. To quote the great Todd Runtle-Stuntle, 'there is always more...'. So, sincere and massive thanks to you good Lord and all who post on here.

Regarding the 1987 CDs, listening to them afresh, I can't believe how good the post '65 albums sound. How did we ever doubt them? Yet you'll recall the excitement when we heard about the 09 releases, which I think many at the time felt were very much needed. I wonder how much of it is the great weight of expectation we all place on each re-issue campaign - 'when are they coming out on CD? We *must* have them on CD.." The CDs come out..."B-b-but the first 4 are only in *mono*.." etc. And to be fair, it was a typically haphazard package - mono or stereo, when both could easily have been accommodated on one disc for most albums, glitches, ADD on the covers when they were AAD, remixes that weren't needed and where they were, didn't address the main issues of the original mix... etc... And yet now we see their many virtues. I'm sure once we all have an analogue-izer phone app we can zap them with to provide some dynamics and auto-lower them to sub-sonic boom levels, ven the Miles remixes will be similarly lauded (Lorded?)

I also think that in a way it's taken this long for the technology to level the playing field and give us the chance to weigh these different masterings more objectively. I've never spent enough on a CD player to get close to the results I can get from an entry level Riga turntable (...of course, I'm playing records on that, so it's a bit unfair to compare.. ;) )But now for not much over a ton, you can get an ifi DAC that wipes the floor with any CD player I've ever had. So even cheapskate enthusiasts like me can get genuinely great sound now that would once have required serious outlay. I remember reading in awe a letter to Gramophone magazine complaining about the fact that you could hear Ringo's bass pedal on the 87 CD version of 'All I've got to do'! But I'm hearing lovely little details on, e.g. the Disque Americ 'Revolver' (thank you whoever posted that up, you're a star!) that have eluded me in 40 years of worshipful listening to that masterpiece all emanating from a tablet or even a phone. And that file along with about 64 Gb of assorted Beatles stuff all sits on a little chip smaller than a fridge magnet.

In that vein, I think the opportunities for AI to completely revolutionise our understanding of the fabs are quite mind-blowing. The remixes have, once the old hi-pass filter/amplify trick has worked its magic, been really insightful and I'm really looking forward to hearing what they can do with the earlier records once the tech allows them to get results that won't demean the originals too much. But as someone who has grown up with first the records then the CDs and now the FLACs of this incredible body of work, there's nothing to match the thrill of hearing something you hadn't before from those incredible original tape sources.

Anyway, thanks to everyone again for this fabulous forum. I will get back to lurking af the back now :)

Bob
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Lord Reith
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Re: Disque Americ Revolver

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Nice post Bob and thanks for the kudos, but there's a lot of other people doing good stuff too.

A couple of years ago I did an in depth analysis of all the various incarnations of the albums. From Revolver onwards the 1987 cds are very good. Mike Jarrett paid just as much attention to detail when he did them as did the 2009 team. There's been a concerted misinformation campaign about them down the years. While it's true he did transfer the first four from a stereo machine, that was only after he had tried one of the old mono ones and didn't like the result. It wasn't through laziness or incompetence like has been made out. In the end those first four don't sound much good but a lot of people compared them to the STEREO lps to come to their conclusions. Apples and oranges. The people who didn't like the 87s have said all sorts of crazy things down the years: "The 87 cds are made from 3rd generation copies", "The 87 cds were put together by junior staff who pulled the first tape they could find out of the library", "The 87 cds are made from production copies not the master tapes". I've also seen again and again that the 87s are No-Noised when they absolutely are not. The only hiss reduction he used was to reduce the treble occasionally on a silent channel with no music (think the intros to Lucy In The Sky or Martha My Dear). There was also no limiting. The eq was basically left alone other than to incorporate some important adjustments that were usually made during cutting to vinyl - like extra treble emphasis - but ignoring the mastering tweaks that had been made purely for technical considerations of the vinyl format. Best of all, he didn't narrow the stereo! All the UK stereo albums have the stereo narrowed considerably and you can always hear a bit of the opposite channel if you turn the balance fully to one side. The fans should have been cockahoop about this. Greater separation! In contrast, some of the 2009 albums like With The Beatles and A Hard Day's Night have the stereo narrowed.

All things considered I think the original vinyls sounded better but only if you have a ridiculously high end system and a perfect copy. That Russian guy who has done the White Album and Abbey Road is a good example. Those two rips are just beautiful. But the 87 cds are pretty damned good too. An audiophile also sent me some examples of rips from his collection and they practically knocked me off my chair. But you need equipment in the six-figure range to get that kind of clarity.

The 2009s sometimes sound good but they don't sound like the lps at all. And frankly there is no reason I can think of why I would listen to, say, the 2009 Pepper over the 87. And even the original stereo Help album on the mono cd doesn't sound as good as the Canadian cd from 1990 with the original stereo mix.
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ringo9
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Re: Disque Americ Revolver

Post by ringo9 »

Thanks for the info guys. I think I'm going on a mystery trip back to 87. I know not everybody here is interested but would anyone get on aboard to start a thread and discuss the best solo cd versions? I mean mainly John and Paul as the are not many options for the others. I seem to recall the two George boxes were clipped.
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Re: Disque Americ Revolver

Post by Lord Reith »

Once again here is my own "best of" list of Beatles cds:

PPM thru BFS: 2009
HELP, RUBBER SOUL, REVOLVER: Disque Americ 1990
PEPPER, MMT, YS, WHITE ALBUM, LET IT BE: 1987
ABBEY ROAD: Toshiba 1983 (with de-emphasis applied)
PAST MASTERS: 1988
SINGLES: 1989
Last edited by Lord Reith on Thu Jul 22, 2021 1:25 am, edited 2 times in total.
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r9453
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Re: Disque Americ Revolver

Post by r9453 »

Thanks for the "best of" list. I can put most of that together from my own collection, except for Help! and TWA (Disque Americ). I never knew I had the 1965 Rubber Soul until I looked:
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michael_charles
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Re: Disque Americ Revolver

Post by michael_charles »

I've never been able to get my hands on the White album Disque Americ, still searching.

MIchael
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20YearsAgo
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Re: Disque Americ Revolver

Post by 20YearsAgo »

michael_charles wrote: Sat Jun 12, 2021 5:23 pm I've never been able to get my hands on the White album Disque Americ, still searching.

MIchael
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=544&p=7474#p7474
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powerPC
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Re: Disque Americ Revolver

Post by powerPC »

Great list LR, thank you for your insight... like r9453, I have most of these sources as well (except for Help! Disque Americ). I really appreciate learning what guys like you, with MUCH better hearing than myself, prefer to listen to... I usually follow those leads, trusting much greater ears than mine. :D

LR (or anyone), I have a question about Abbey Road (toshiba) which PROBABLY belongs in a new thread... If so, I'll be glad to create a thread for that. But you mentioned de-emphasis applied; I remember when I got mine, it was already in FLAC format with no mention of de-emphasis applied to it or not. I do recall reading (or hearing) that the de-emphasis was automatically applied by some CD players when playing back the CD itself? I may have misunderstood all that discussion going on, but my question to you is would it be possible to make the FLAC files to include the de-emphasis? (it's all greek to me, any insight into this would be greatly appreciated!)
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michael_charles
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Re: Disque Americ Revolver

Post by michael_charles »

20YearsAgo wrote: Sat Jun 12, 2021 5:39 pm
michael_charles wrote: Sat Jun 12, 2021 5:23 pm I've never been able to get my hands on the White album Disque Americ, still searching.

MIchael
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=544&p=7474#p7474
20yearsgo, Sorry for the question are you saying go there for my post as the WA Disque Americ has not been posted on this site, nor in that thread, from my knowledge.

Thanks,

Michael
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noirbar
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Re: Disque Americ Revolver

Post by noirbar »

Love this thread. Would also love to hear "that Russian guy's" White Album rip.
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